Wesley Clark: NATO Must Remain Within Its Borders

For the possibility of establishing a no-fly zone over Ukraine, Clark says NATO should remain within its borders.

Speaking to Radio Free Europe, he says international mechanisms should sue Russian President Vladimir Putin and his generals for war crimes.

“If described as a war criminal, other countries cannot deal with it, financial institutions cannot deal with it and it will end up as [former Serbian president, Slobodan] Milosevic on trial, at The Hague”, Clark says.

Clark, who has served as commander-in-chief of NATO's European forces, also says the alliance should take a series of measures to respond if Russia crosses its borders.

Radio Free Europe: What should NATO countries, especially the US, do to help Ukraine?

Wesley Clark: Individual countries must do everything they can to support Ukrainian forces on the battlefield.

Radio Free Europe: But would they provoke a broader war if they sent to Ukraine, say, airplanes, missiles...?

Wesley Clark: Russia has committed 100% of its fighting forces. The forces have been too incompetent. They are vulnerable if NATO countries individually offer the anti-antical Ukraine and the air support needed to back those forces.

Radio Free Europe: The West insists it will not be involved in war, but will arm Ukraine. Isn't that involvement?

Wesley Clark: We said from the beginning that we would support Ukraine in the war. We're not doing this on American forces. All right, don't do it! But that doesn't mean we don't give Ukraine supplies, ammunition, technology, intelligence information. We have to do this.

Radio Free Europe: Besides providing military equipment for Ukraine, what should NATO do now?

Wesley Clark: NATO must prepare itself. That includes planning and adjusting forces. The countries must resell the budget; in certain cases, the reserve will be mobilized. This includes building infrastructure projects, preparing logistical roads and a host of other measures so that NATO can respond if Russia crosses its borders.

Radio Free Europe: Do you think it should be declared a no-fly zone over Ukraine?

Wesley Clark: I think now NATO must remain within its borders. But individual NATO countries can do what they must to help Ukraine.

Radio Free Europe: Do you think a time will come when NATO will be involved?

Wesley Clark: That really depends on Mr. Putin. But if you look at the targets set forth in diplomatic documents that surrendered in the autumn... He has demanded that NATO forces disperse and leave Eastern Europe, has demanded that these countries be stripped of NATO protection, and that is unacceptable. But if this is his objective and he's prepared to threaten us and fight for him, then I think there will be war.

Radio Free Europe: From what you see in Russian troop movements and tactics, what do you think Putin's real target in this war?

Wesley Clark: His real goal is to destroy the possibility of Ukraine lining up with West, including NATO and defeat NATO with the threat or use of nuclear or chemical weapons and then regain control of Eastern Europe and force the US to flee.

Radio Free Europe: You think I'm gonna make it?

Wesley Clark: I don't think so. But it depends on leadership and civil opinion in each of our democracies.

Radio Free Europe: Is there anything the West can do to degrade Russian capacities if Putin continues to escalate the situation?

Wesley Clark: Of course, Putin will continue to escalate the situation, because his goal is to break Ukraine's will and resistance. We have to sue Putin for war crimes, as do his generals, and we have to name Russia a deceitful state. We must encourage all countries in the world not to do business with Russia, to cut off all trade with him. All of this can help. But this is a battle that will be determined by the results on the ground in Ukraine.

Radio Free Europe: Do you think they'll be scared if international mechanisms claim war criminals?

Wesley Clark: I think there's going to be an extraordinary difference between being named a war criminal, because that means that other countries can't deal with it, financial institutions can't deal with it and it will end up as [former Serbian president, Slobodan] Milosevic on trial, at The Hague.

Radio Free Europe: Do you think Putin is considering using nuclear weapons?

Wesley Clark: I think he's capable of using nuclear weapons. And for that reason, we must resist now. Because when you get involved under those threats, there's no stopping.

Radio Free Europe: But then there is the danger of nuclear war?

Wesley Clark: We risk a lot of things. But the question is either take a stand or not. We have learned the lesson in the 1930s in the West when we have not taken a firm stand against Adolf Hitler, and it is all over in war. If we don't stand up against Putin now, it will end with the third world war. The only way to avoid him is to stand against him now.

Radio Free Europe: Do you think sanctions will work?

Wesley Clark: I think sanctions show the determination and seriousness of the West. I don't think they'll stop Mr. Putin's aggression.

“If Ukraine's resistance is strong, Putin collapses”

Radio Free Europe: What do you think of the talks taking place between the Russian and Ukrainian delegations?

Wesley Clark: I think that any conversation between NATO ministers is excellent. I think any conversation with the Russian Foreign Minister should be seen with great suspicion. Their aim is to confuse the West and give Putin time to reshuffle forces for mass destruction in the cities of Ukraine.

Radio Free Europe: How do you see the end of this war?

Wesley Clark: Depends on the outcome in Ukraine. You can't see beyond Ukraine.

Radio Free Europe: Was Ukraine's resistance expected?

Wesley Clark: Absolutely. The question is whether Ukrainian resistance will be strong enough to withstand Russian aggression. If it's strong enough, Putin retires, certainly falls, will fall on his men and end up on trial for war crimes. If it's not strong enough, something else will happen. It will be a danger elsewhere in the world. For example, the invasion of Taiwan from China, or the invasion of NATO lands directly from Putin.